Cheating in games

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Is it ok to cheat in a game

Yes
8
42%
No
11
58%
 
Total votes: 19

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eMTe
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Re: Cheating in games

Post by eMTe » Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:41

I hope the word "cheat" isnt problematic in English and cannot be used in multiple ways. So, for me, the term "cheating" is used improperly when we talk about computer games, because nobody gets harmed when you use cheat code or speedhack or whatever - you simply help yourself, make game easier. Submitting the score achieved that way while the rules clearly say "no cheatcodes" to online table is actual cheating.
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Re: Cheating in games

Post by Zyx » Thu Apr 26, 2012 12:26

eMTe wrote:So, for me, the term "cheating" is used improperly when we talk about computer games, because nobody gets harmed when you use cheat code or speedhack or whatever - you simply help yourself, make game easier.
I think it is still cheating even if your cheating does not affect others, but of course the ethical implications are totally different. Some would even consider looking at a walkthrough cheating, especially in puzzle or adventure games.

Of course, what is cheating depends totally on context and the community. There's even a book on the subject when it comes to fighting games like Tekken and Street Fighter.
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Re: Cheating in games

Post by Master_X » Thu Apr 26, 2012 20:08

It depends. If you cheat in multiplayer games you violate their terms and conditions (most of the time). Most of the time you get a year ban for hacking. Warning for a minor and permaban for something like changing game currency.

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Re: Cheating in games

Post by eMTe » Fri Apr 27, 2012 20:08

Zyx wrote:I think it is still cheating even if your cheating does not affect others
This is actually what I am trying to understand - how can you use the word "cheat" in English. Can you cheat only somebody or can you cheat also yourself or unanimated object like the computer game.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cheat

Im not an English expert, quite contrary, but I think "cheating" isnt a properly used world regarding computer games and The Free Dictionary is for me a reliable site. Cheat is mentioned as "disallowed technique", but to disallow something you must first have two opposed parties - one that disallows something and one who makes use of disallowed technique. Developers frequently provide cheat codes themselves to encourage less skilled players to play the game. So the word "cheat" for me has strictly ethical connotations - if I use walkthrough or codes to advance I ruin the fun for myself, but as soon as I dont take part in some kind of competition against other people it's not cheating.
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Re: Cheating in games

Post by Chroelle » Fri Apr 27, 2012 21:03

But that would mean that using a IDSPISPOPD code would not be cheating but using a trainer that has the same function would be cheating... I mean the trainer was something not allowed by the developer, but built by someone else, whereas the cheatcode IDSPISPOPD is incorporated in the game by the developer.
I believe cheating to be playing the game by means not meant to be used to play the game originally.
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Re: Cheating in games

Post by Scythe » Sat Apr 28, 2012 12:36

eMTe wrote:This is actually what I am trying to understand - how can you use the word "cheat" in English. Can you cheat only somebody or can you cheat also yourself or unanimated object like the computer game.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cheat

Im not an English expert, quite contrary, but I think "cheating" isnt a properly used world regarding computer games and The Free Dictionary is for me a reliable site. Cheat is mentioned as "disallowed technique", but to disallow something you must first have two opposed parties - one that disallows something and one who makes use of disallowed technique. Developers frequently provide cheat codes themselves to encourage less skilled players to play the game. So the word "cheat" for me has strictly ethical connotations - if I use walkthrough or codes to advance I ruin the fun for myself, but as soon as I dont take part in some kind of competition against other people it's not cheating.
You can certainly cheat in a game of solitaire (cards). I wouldn't know what else to call it. You're breaking the rules intentionally, to give yourself an advantage that was not intended.

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Re: Cheating in games

Post by eMTe » Sat Apr 28, 2012 14:51

Point earned.
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Re: Cheating in games

Post by Zyx » Sat Apr 28, 2012 21:08

I considered using the solitaire example myself. If rules are broken and no-one is there to see, were the rules broken and did it make any noise? =)
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Re: Cheating in games

Post by eMTe » Sat Apr 28, 2012 22:44

Well, what if the game has difficulty levels? If the difficulty level is called "normal" you may feel that beating the game on this level is like developers meant it to be beaten. So playing it on easy level is kind of cheating. But there's also hard level. Normal level is easier than hard level, so you cheat playing on normal level, because you dont follow the "hard" rules - enemies are usually less powerful and less numerous and you receive less damage when hit. Doom I and II for example are impossible for me to beat on nightmare levels - I dont have enough patience. On the contrary I managed to beat Quake II on hardest level whatever is its name (also nightmare like in Dooms? - I forgot), because it is one of the easiest fps ever made. So if I had to replay Quake II Id consider "cheating" playing on any level lower than hardest one.
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Re: Cheating in games

Post by Scythe » Sun Apr 29, 2012 10:42

And what if harder difficulty levels are unlocked by completing the game on lower ones? The mind rebels at these conundrums....

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Re: Cheating in games

Post by Chroelle » Sun Apr 29, 2012 12:58

I wouldalways say that normal level is the one intended to be played by the developer, and as such the easier and harder levels are set for players who tried the normal difficulty and would like more of a/ less of a challenge in the game. I dont believe it to be cheating to play it in easy difficulty as it is a decision you make before you begin playing. Were you able to switch difficulty midgame and switch back, then I would perhaps call it cheating. Like you are going over hard difficulty and meet an enemy you cannot defeat on hard difficulty, then you switch to easy and beat him (easily) and then afterwards return to hard difficulty, not letting show that you have given yourself an unintended advantage... But if you decide what difficulty to play before you begin, then I see no cheating. The rule would be: If you decide on some rules and then start playing it is not cheating - unless you midgame decide to change the rules to your advantage". The conundrum would be: What if I changed the difficulty up and then down - would that be cheating?
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Re: Cheating in games

Post by eMTe » Sun Apr 29, 2012 22:47

Scythe wrote:The mind rebels at these conundrums....
I would say that discussions like this one create good webforum. But it is of course important to know where to stop, otherwise any topic can turn into philosophical debate and such debates usually have no end. That's why I proposed to talk about the meaning and use of world "cheat" in English, because, for me, we still talk about two different worlds - 1) making the game easier to play/finish for personal use, even if it is solitaire and 2) taking advantage of another person's unawareness.
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Re: Cheating in games

Post by Chroelle » Sat May 05, 2012 11:41

In my world they are closer to eachother than I think they are in yours. Taking advantage of another persons unawareness could also be being aware of a cheatcode/hack/error/system that another player might not be aware of. Even in Solitaire. :)

If you go deep into it on a philospohical level, then there is no non-personal-use. Even if you cheat yourself and beat solitaire 3 times an hour, then as you walk out the door you walk out with the knowledge that you are the kind of guy that always win at solitaire, or you walk out the door with a feeling that you could never win in Solitaire without winning (I didnt define personal use as being positive). If you meet a guy that beat solitaire without cheating only once every hour, and you talk about it, never mentioning the cheat, then you would separate with the knowledge that you were either better than him or worse than him. He would on the other hand walk away with a knowledge that he was worse than you. Oh...and I could go on, but I wont. :) (You can thank me later for that).
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Re:

Post by eMTe » Thu Jan 25, 2018 19:43

eMTe wrote:I'm stuck in Gabriel Knight 1 for three years now, but I promised myself that I'll never use walkthrough in this one of my fav games of all time. Why? Because I used it playing Indy IV a bit earlier. I was walking around the same screens for several days and finally I decided to cheat. When I saw how easy the solution was I was so angry that I stopped playing for several months. Being stuck in GK also takes all the fun from playing, but being a quite experienced gamer now I know that checking the game for the 100th time after some years is often worth a try - countless times Ive finished games playing them from the beginning or from the stuck point after a year or longer break.
This post was written in March 2006, so adding to that 3 years of being stuck BY THEN it's 15 years. But it paid.

Around 21:55-22:00 on 23rd of January A.D. 2018 I have found - by accident of course - the damned hotspot that I hadn't even been looking for and around 18:30 on 25th of January A.D. 2018 I have finally progressed to Day 4.

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Re: Cheating in games

Post by Zyx » Thu Jan 25, 2018 21:43

That is patience. I remember getting stuck on the first Monkey Island, if I remember correctly I wasn't able to find a stick or something, and it took years before I continued the game.
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Re: Cheating in games

Post by Drasir-Vel » Mon Jan 29, 2018 23:36

It must be very satisfying when you finally solve it then. Personally i have a more lax relationship with walkthroughs. My goal of the game is more like that of reading a book, i do it for the story, the setting, and such, and less for the puzzle. But it all depends i guess, on what you want to get out of it.

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Re: Re:

Post by eMTe » Thu Feb 01, 2018 14:38

eMTe wrote:Around 21:55-22:00 on 23rd of January A.D. 2018 I have found - by accident of course - the damned hotspot that I hadn't even been looking for and around 18:30 on 25th of January A.D. 2018 I have finally progressed to Day 4.
...only to get stuck again, for a couple more years to come, I believe.

Stick in Monkey Island?
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Re: Cheating in games

Post by Zyx » Fri Feb 02, 2018 9:04

Actually, it was MI2 and I thought I needed a stick. I can't remember if on second try I realized I didn't actually need a stick.
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Re: Cheating in games

Post by eMTe » Wed Jun 13, 2018 23:17

Getting stick and getting stuck are apparently too different things.
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